MRN Schedule 2/19/68 - 9/4/09

[UUrselfRSpecial]

Since she was in 1645 and was in 1386, that was not nearly as long an interval as in the fall of 2000.

Then I'm sure you're right, and fall 2000 is the longest.

But they move episodes for less of a reason for that (meaning, no aparent reason, such as Conflict and Work in 1985).

Neither was moved in 1985, but I do get your point. However, I think whatever their reason was, even if it was random, it makes more sense than 14 consecutive Bettyless episodes.

Incidentally, I do wonder what the longest interval is for other characters, especially major. Daniel, probably the leading puppet, of post-75s, is only not seen in Creativity and The Environment, which have never aired back to back, but I don't know about pre-79s. As for Friday, the only weeks they weren't in were 1016 - 1025 (and 1026 - 1029, which is their honeymoon), 1266 - 1270, and Josephine. Josephine debuted long after 1016 - 1030 last aired, and neither that and 1016 - 1029 has aired back to back with 1266 - 1270 (at least Josephine hasn't, but 1016 - 1030 is unlikely). So probably, since 1001 - 1030 can't be interrupted, all 1016 - 1029 airings are the longest. If we want to think more Children's Corner characters, the only others are X and Henrietta, but I do think they weren't seen as much in the post-75s, so maybe a week without them wasn't so much a big deal. Though could you check and see which weeks they weren't in? And as for other major characters, could you also check Lady Elaine, since I think she was more major in the post-75s. And since I really think he was the second biggest human character, also check Mr. McFeely, although I think I found that the only week he wasn't in, both pre-79 and post-75, was 1311 - 1315, correct? Or was there another? Could you check and see when is last 1306 - 1310 and first 1316 - 1320 appearances are, to see if we could figure out the longest? And the only confirmed time that 1316 - 1320 didn't immediately follow 1315 was for Superheroes in 1987. Could you check his first Superheroes appearance to see if it's later in the week than 1316 - 1320? I seem to remember he was in 1467, but don't remember 1466.

That's right, since the article was dated May 20, 1982, and even though it gave no airdate, it was clearly talking about the future, not the past, so it was likely talking about May 24-28, 1982.  That means that 1125 has another significant airdate for my wife and I!

But sadly for you and your wife, that still doesn't prove that 1192 and 1193 did air after May 20, so it's still possible that it did air Feb. 5 instead. But it is still most likely

Two others that I realized: You have it airing Nov. 12, 1971.  My wife and I got married on Nov. 13, 2010 (and Nov. 12, 2010 was our rehearsal dinner!)  So our engagement, engagement party, her shower, and our rehearsal dinner were all on likely airdates of 1125!

Yes! Though the rehearsal dinner is sadly not confirmed. Though if it does, all the ones that you were at (I'm guessing you weren't at the shower) were the first three airdates!

A near miss is Mar. 30, 1984.  I met her parents on Mar. 29, 2003.

That is an interesting near miss.

Although I do not specifically remember its 1984 airdate, I do remember very well being sick, and watching the episode in bed on a small, battery powered black and white TV.  The weather history for my area shows snow for that day, and I do vaguely remember falling asleap after 1125, and when I woke up, my parents told me that it had snowed while I was alseap.

I'm sure that airdate is correct, and not just from this memory.

No, you are correct.  Feb. 12, 1994 was a Saturday, and 1994 was before 1998.  I do remember the opening ceremony being on Feb. 12, 1994.

Then I'm sure that airdate is correct.

I also realized that I was wrong about 1998.  Wikipedia says the opening ceremony in 1998 was Feb. 7 (a Saturday).  So it was moved to a Friday in 2002, and Wikipedia shows that the opening ceremony in 2002 was on Feb. 8, a Friday (which I do remember).

According to Wikipedia, the opening ceremony was July 25, 1992, which was a Saturday.  So you are right about 1996 being when the summer olympic opening ceremony was moved to a Friday.

I wonder then why they moved back to Saturday just for winter 1998 when it was Friday in summer 1996. What about summer 2000? Was that September 15 or 16? I do seem to remember September 15 for that one.

[UUrselfRSpecial]

By the way, another alleged airdate is the Paley Center shows 1101 as having aired Oct. 25, 1971.  Your schedule does not show it airing that date.  So are you just assuming that to be an error?  Interestingly, that is the correct day of the week (Monday).

I still think its airing 10/11/71 makes more sense, since Paley Center isn't confirmed, and they have many other debut dates that are incorrect, such as 1089 on 4/1/78, and that's a Saturday!!!!!!!!

Since I know you said that you saw 1101 at the Paley Center, do you remember if it had the trolley closing or not? 

It sure did!!!!! All pre-79s did.

If so, then it is unlikely that what they have is from a 1971 airing, since we don't think the trolley closing was added that early, meaning the date is likely wrong.

I'm sure it's wrong.

If it does not have the trolley closing but has the 1971 PBS animation with the moog synthesizer, then it was likely an airdate between 1971 and 1975, with a possibly correct air date. If it has the NET animation, then it was likely its original airdate in 1970 with a wrong airdate.

I don't remember what PBS animation it had, but I heard that 1001 - 1535 aired the moog synthesizer PBS animation for many years after that animation stopped, and same with the Split P one for 1536 - 1610, and that lasted til long after 1001 last aired. So if it had the moog synthesizer, there's no way to tell when the airing is from.

[mitsguy2001]

Neither was moved in 1985, but I do get your point. However, I think whatever their reason was, even if it was random, it makes more sense than 14 consecutive Bettyless episodes.

That was a typo.  I meant 1986.

Incidentally, I do wonder what the longest interval is for other characters, especially major. Daniel, probably the leading puppet, of post-75s, is only not seen in Creativity and The Environment, which have never aired back to back, but I don't know about pre-79s.

I'm not sure offhand.  But I remember being surprised to see that there were many weeks from the 1974 season that he was not in.  I don't remember how many of them were consecutive.  I wonder if maybe  the Daniel puppet was damaged and it took a few weeks to make a new one?

Two others that I realized: You have it airing Nov. 12, 1971.  My wife and I got married on Nov. 13, 2010 (and Nov. 12, 2010 was our rehearsal dinner!)  So our engagement, engagement party, her shower, and our rehearsal dinner were all on likely airdates of 1125!

Yes! Though the rehearsal dinner is sadly not confirmed. Though if it does, all the ones that you were at (I'm guessing you weren't at the shower) were the first three airdates!

Although Feb. 12, 1971 isn't exactly confirmed either.

I wonder then why they moved back to Saturday just for winter 1998 when it was Friday in summer 1996. What about summer 2000? Was that September 15 or 16? I do seem to remember September 15 for that one.

Sept. 15

[mitsguy2001]

By the way, you have a post (#62 on this thread) that is just a quote of one of your previous posts with nothing added.  I assume that was not what you intended.  You may want to re-post whatever you intended to post.

[mitsguy2001]

I still think its airing 10/11/71 makes more sense, since Paley Center isn't confirmed, and they have many other debut dates that are incorrect, such as 1089 on 4/1/78, and that's a Saturday!!!!!!!!

The dates that the Paley Center has are not necessarily debut dates, just the airdate from when it was recorded.  4/1/78 sounds like a likely airdate for 1089 on a station that reran MRN on weekends.

Since I know you said that you saw 1101 at the Paley Center, do you remember if it had the trolley closing or not?

It sure did!!!!! All pre-79s did.

Other people here have seen pre-79s at the Paley Center that did not have the trolley closing.  They went directly from the closing credits to the 1971 PBS animation.  They were obviously taped before 1976.  The episodes you saw at the Paley Center were probably all taped after 1976 if they had the trolley closing.

I don't remember what PBS animation it had, but I heard that 1001 - 1535 aired the moog synthesizer PBS animation for many years after that animation stopped, and same with the Split P one for 1536 - 1610, and that lasted til long after 1001 last aired. So if it had the moog synthesizer, there's no way to tell when the airing is from.

That I think varied by station.  I know for sure that on WNET and WLIW, the 1971 PBS animation with the moog synthesizer was not used after the summer of 1984, even when rerunning old episodes.  In fact, when I saw 1066 on June 2, 1986, I was wondering if it would be back, but it wasn't.

In any case, what I meant was that you could determine the era of the Paley Center's copy of 1101 based on the following:

No trolley closing, and NET animation: 1970 (and the Oct. 25, 1971 airdate is likely wrong)
No trolley closing, and 1971 PBS animation with moog synthesizer: 1971-1975 (and the Oct. 25, 1971 airdate is possibly correct)
Trolley closing: 1976 or later (and the OCt. 25, 1971 airdate is likely wrong).

Also, keep in mind that from 1971 to 1977, Veterans Day was moved (for whatever reason) to the 4th Monday of October.  So maybe they specifically wanted to air 1101 on that day?

If you are 100% certain that the Paley Center's copy of 1101 has the trolley closing, then it was obviously shot after 1971, and its airdate is obviously wrong.  I wonder if it could have aired that day in 1976 or 1982, but neither seem likely.

[UUrselfRSpecial]

That was a typo.  I meant 1986.

I understand, but still, I get your point.

Incidentally, I do wonder what the longest interval is for other characters, especially major. Daniel, probably the leading puppet, of post-75s, is only not seen in Creativity and The Environment, which have never aired back to back, but I don't know about pre-79s.

I'm not sure offhand.  But I remember being surprised to see that there were many weeks from the 1974 season that he was not in.  I don't remember how many of them were consecutive.  I wonder if maybe  the Daniel puppet was damaged and it took a few weeks to make a new one?

Somehow I doubt it. Though it'd be interesting to see Daniel from 1973 and 1975 weeks to compare.

Two others that I realized: You have it airing Nov. 12, 1971.  My wife and I got married on Nov. 13, 2010 (and Nov. 12, 2010 was our rehearsal dinner!)  So our engagement, engagement party, her shower, and our rehearsal dinner were all on likely airdates of 1125!

Yes! Though the rehearsal dinner is sadly not confirmed. Though if it does, all the ones that you were at (I'm guessing you weren't at the shower) were the first three airdates!

Although Feb. 12, 1971 isn't exactly confirmed either.

Yes you're right. So only the engagement party is confirmed, and not the proposal or rehearsal dinner. I also realized that just maybe, if they reran the season three times in between seasons, which is what I originally thought years ago before I heard about the July 12, 1973 article, then maybe it aired Nov. 13, 1970, so it'd be your wedding day, which of course is a much bigger deal than your rehearsal dinner!

[UUrselfRSpecial]

The dates that the Paley Center has are not necessarily debut dates, just the airdate from when it was recorded.  4/1/78 sounds like a likely airdate for 1089 on a station that reran MRN on weekends.

And by the same token, 10/25/71 could be from a station that reran the episode 2 weeks later, similar to the memory of 1315 on 2/18/83, which I have three weeks earlier.

Other people here have seen pre-79s at the Paley Center that did not have the trolley closing.  They went directly from the closing credits to the 1971 PBS animation.  They were obviously taped before 1976.  The episodes you saw at the Paley Center were probably all taped after 1976 if they had the trolley closing.

But I still think debut date doesn't necessarily mean tape date. In fact, a lot of episodes with the correct debut date have the trolley closing, so that proves it.

I don't remember what PBS animation it had, but I heard that 1001 - 1535 aired the moog synthesizer PBS animation for many years after that animation stopped, and same with the Split P one for 1536 - 1610, and that lasted til long after 1001 last aired. So if it had the moog synthesizer, there's no way to tell when the airing is from.

That I think varied by station.  I know for sure that on WNET and WLIW, the 1971 PBS animation with the moog synthesizer was not used after the summer of 1984, even when rerunning old episodes.  In fact, when I saw 1066 on June 2, 1986, I was wondering if it would be back, but it wasn't.

Are you sure it was both on WNET and WLIW? WLIW I can understand, since it's a low budget station, but not WNET. Also, the recording I have of 1181 from 6/18/90, which I heard is from WNET, has the moog synthesizer. And I have a memory of, when I saw 1319 on 5/9/85 on WNET, seeing the moog synthesizer Anyway, apart from this, what I said about PBS animations isn't from memory, but from someone on the yahoo board who told me.

In any case, what I meant was that you could determine the era of the Paley Center's copy of 1101 based on the following:

No trolley closing, and NET animation: 1970 (and the Oct. 25, 1971 airdate is likely wrong)

That, as I said, is not true.

No trolley closing, and 1971 PBS animation with moog synthesizer: 1971-1975 (and the Oct. 25, 1971 airdate is possibly correct)

That as I said, is not it.

Trolley closing: 1976 or later (and the OCt. 25, 1971 airdate is likely wrong).

That's the most likely, but for other reasons, I really do think it's wrong.

Also, keep in mind that from 1971 to 1977, Veterans Day was moved (for whatever reason) to the 4th Monday of October.  So maybe they specifically wanted to air 1101 on that day?

But the date I have it is also a holiday, Columbus Day! So if it's already airing on a holiday, why would they move it to a different holiday?

If you are 100% certain that the Paley Center's copy of 1101 has the trolley closing, then it was obviously shot after 1971, and its airdate is obviously wrong.  I wonder if it could have aired that day in 1976 or 1982, but neither seem likely.

I don't see this as a typo from 1976 or 1982. Definitely not 1976, And besides, the episodes I have for 1982, as well as 1976, is nowhere near 1101.

[mitsguy2001]

And by the same token, 10/25/71 could be from a station that reran the episode 2 weeks later, similar to the memory of 1315 on 2/18/83, which I have three weeks earlier.

Good point.

I was also thinking about its 4/1/78 airdate for 1089.  Remember, many sources mention that starting in 1976, edited versions of the colored episodes would air.  So, I'm thinking that 1001-1455 are the edited versions of former episodes 131-585.  The one episode we know for sure was edited was 1121, which would be the edited version of 251.  So maybe 4/1/78 (really 3/30/78) was the debut of 1089, as opposed to 219.

Are you sure it was both on WNET and WLIW? WLIW I can understand, since it's a low budget station, but not WNET. Also, the recording I have of 1181 from 6/18/90, which I heard is from WNET, has the moog synthesizer. And I have a memory of, when I saw 1319 on 5/9/85 on WNET, seeing the moog synthesizer Anyway, apart from this, what I said about PBS animations isn't from memory, but from someone on the yahoo board who told me.

I could be wrong about 1984 (maybe it was 1985), but I know for sure it did not have the PBS animation with the moog synthesizer in 1986.  I was specifically looking for it, and it wasn't there.  Maybe it was reintroduced sometime before 1990.  I remember that once the P Heads were intorduced (which I thought was the summer of 1984), I never saw the animation with the moog syntheizer ever again.

In any case, what I meant was that you could determine the era of the Paley Center's copy of 1101 based on the following:

No trolley closing, and NET animation: 1970 (and the Oct. 25, 1971 airdate is likely wrong)

That, as I said, is not true.

Come to think of it, since every known copy of every known black and white episode seems to still have the NET animation, that implies that the black and white episodes probably never aired after 1970.

[mitsguy2001]

Incidentally, I do wonder what the longest interval is for other characters, especially major. Daniel, probably the leading puppet, of post-75s, is only not seen in Creativity and The Environment, which have never aired back to back,

I have heard that the Exxon-Valdez oil spill in 1989 was one of the events that inspired The Environment week (as well as garbage washing up on beaches during the summers of 1987 and 1988).  I wonder if Daniel not appearing in The Environment week could have had anything to do with the fact that Exxon's mascott is a tiger.

[mitsguy2001]

I also wonder if, by any chance, if 1125 could have aired a week later than listed in 1982 (not saying you are wrong; just saying it would have been more interesting with respect to my personal life).

Yes, and Lincoln's Birthday was still observed in 1982, so the significance to 1971 is the same as 1982! And I think it could easily have aired one week later for completely different reasons (from the article I saw years ago, it really looks like 1191 - 1195 aired May 24 - 28, 1982, not May 17 - 21, as I have it. I'd have to think of how that could be possible.

Actually, it's fairly obvious.  Creativity probably did not have a second airing in August 1982.

[UUrselfRSpecial]

I was also thinking about its 4/1/78 airdate for 1089.  Remember, many sources mention that starting in 1976, edited versions of the colored episodes would air.  So, I'm thinking that 1001-1455 are the edited versions of former episodes 131-585.  The one episode we know for sure was edited was 1121, which would be the edited version of 251.  So maybe 4/1/78 (really 3/30/78) was the debut of 1089, as opposed to 219.

That's interesting. But it's not like all 455 of the episodes that had their numbers changed were edited. And also, this would be the second bulk airing, not the first, and the 1001 - 1455 episodes would debut in the first, the debut of 1089 as opposed to 219 would be 6/24/76, not 3/30/78.

Also, on the topic of debut dates at the Paley Center, there is one that I know is an incorrect airdate, as well as debut date, for Sesame Street. The Season 10 premiere, 1186, has 10/19/78. Since the first 33 seasons all had a number of episodes equal to a multiple of 5, all season premieres were on a Monday, and all those seasons were uninterrupted, like MRN, each episode that ended in 1 and 6 were Monday episodes, 2 and 7 were Tuesday, etc. However, 10/19/78 was a Thursday!!!!! But we know it wasn't Monday 10/16/78 for the following reason. First, the Old School DVD set, which has the Season 1 - 10 premieres plus clips from those seasons, has debut dates for those season premieres, and the debut date it gives is 11/27/78. And I believe that more, not only because the Old School DVD set is a more official source. We know that Seasons 1 and 3 - 29 had 130 episodes per season and Season 2, 145, which explains why the Season 10 premiere is 1186. We also know that for the 130 episode seasons, at least when the season premieres were 52 weeks apart, reran each season, compete, uncut, and in order, in between seasons, and that the show itself premiered Nov. 10, 1969. Even though not all season premieres between then and Season 10 aren't 52 weeks apart, (ironically, the interval between Season 2 and 3 is! But not all between Seasons 3 and 10 are, since the Season 3 premiere was 11/8/71, not 12/6), they were all not much more or less than 52 weeks apart, so there were some weeks that either didn't rerun or aired three times, but not many. So this means that all season premieres were sometime in November, hence 11/27/78.

For the record, here's when all SS season premieres were, after of course the series premiere:
Season 2: 11/9/70 (So Season 1 obviously aired and then reran the 130 episodes complete, uncut, and in order)
Season 3: As I said, 11/8/71
Season 4: 11/27/72
Season 5: 11/19/73
Season 6: 11/4/74
Season 7: 12/1/75 (yes, December, but early December, and that's the only one not in November. And since 11/27/78 is 156, or 52 times 3, weeks after 12/1/75, that's most likely when they started rerunning seasons complete, uncut, and in order in between seasons. And indeed, Season 8 is 11/29/76 (52 weeks from 12/1/75), 11/28/77 (52 weeks both after 11/29/76 and before 11/28/77).

We don't know Seasons 11 - 14 for sure, but we do know Season 15, both from memories of people on SS boards and the debut of an episode from that season, 1839 on 11/24/83, that the premiere, obviously 1836, was obviulsy 11/21/83, which is indeed 260, or 52 times 5, weeks from 11/27/78. Then after the Season 24 finale, 3135, reran on 11/5/93 (520, or 52 times 10, weeks after 11/21/83), the first two weeks of Season 24, 3006 - 3015, aired a third time, then on 11/22/93, Season 25 premiered. Then when Season 30 premiered on 11/16/98 (260, or 52 times 5, weeks after 11/22/93), that was the last November season premiere, since there were fewer than 130 episodes per season starting in Season 30.

Are you sure it was both on WNET and WLIW? WLIW I can understand, since it's a low budget station, but not WNET. Also, the recording I have of 1181 from 6/18/90, which I heard is from WNET, has the moog synthesizer. And I have a memory of, when I saw 1319 on 5/9/85 on WNET, seeing the moog synthesizer Anyway, apart from this, what I said about PBS animations isn't from memory, but from someone on the yahoo board who told me.

I could be wrong about 1984 (maybe it was 1985),

Now that I think of it, it was after SS on 5/9/85, not after MRN. But since that was a new episode, it's surprising that would be a moog synthesizer.

but I know for sure it did not have the PBS animation with the moog synthesizer in 1986.  I was specifically looking for it, and it wasn't there.  Maybe it was reintroduced sometime before 1990.  I remember that once the P Heads were intorduced (which I thought was the summer of 1984),

The P-Heads are actually the moog synthesizer; it's the Split P that was introduced in 1984. However, it wasn't the summer; it was Oct. 1, which is still between 1535 and 1536.

I never saw the animation with the moog syntheizer ever again.

And even if it wasn't on 6/2/86 that you saw 1066 on NET (or at least the end when they'd show the PBS ident), you definitely did on WNET at some point, and you stopped watching before 1990.

Come to think of it, since every known copy of every known black and white episode seems to still have the NET animation, that implies that the black and white episodes probably never aired after 1970.

But all those could be from recordings from before 1970, and there could be airings from after 1970 that weren't recorded (or at least in any recordings you saw). However, since NET changed to PBS on Oct. 5, 1970, and I have the last black and white episode on Aug. 21, I'm sure all airings were with NET animations.

[mitsguy2001]

but I know for sure it did not have the PBS animation with the moog synthesizer in 1986.  I was specifically looking for it, and it wasn't there.  Maybe it was reintroduced sometime before 1990.  I remember that once the P Heads were intorduced (which I thought was the summer of 1984),

The P-Heads are actually the moog synthesizer; it's the Split P that was introduced in 1984. However, it wasn't the summer; it was Oct. 1, which is still between 1535 and 1536.

I know, I mistyped.  What I meant to say is that after the Split P was introduced, I never saw the P Heads ever again on TV, even though I watched MRN regularly during the summer of 1986.

I never saw the animation with the moog syntheizer ever again.

And even if it wasn't on 6/2/86 that you saw 1066 on NET (or at least the end when they'd show the PBS ident), you definitely did on WNET at some point, and you stopped watching before 1990.

Again, once the Split P was introduced, I never saw the P Heads ever again on TV.

[UUrselfRSpecial]

[
I have heard that the Exxon-Valdez oil spill in 1989 was one of the events that inspired The Environment week (as well as garbage washing up on beaches during the summers of 1987 and 1988).  I wonder if Daniel not appearing in The Environment week could have had anything to do with the fact that Exxon's mascott is a tiger.

That's really interesting, but somehow I doubt it.

[UUrselfRSpecial]

Actually, it's fairly obvious.  Creativity probably did not have a second airing in August 1982.

When I have time, maybe I'll fix the schedule to include Creativity  not reairing in August 1982, and another week airing between 2/2/81 and 5/21/82 (maybe (and most likely) after 2/1/82 so that you know what phenomenon could occur!)

[UUrselfRSpecial]

I know, I mistyped.  What I meant to say is that after the Split P was introduced, I never saw the P Heads ever again on TV, even though I watched MRN regularly during the summer of 1986.

I understand what you meant. And in the time you watched regularly in the summer of 1986, I'm guessing most (and at least one) it was on WNET, at least for the end with the PBS ident.